Thursday, November 19, 2009
Can Osprey Cove, or any gated community, legally bar non-resident political candidates from entry for purposes of campaigning door-to-door ?
BoB
Saint Marys, GA
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#22
1 hr ago Judged:
1
I was at a meeting last night and it was pointed out that the Osprey Cove community was not open to any one campagining unless they lived in that community. That is some thing that has to be also looked into. It was pointed out they can go into any neighborhood in the city and ask for votes. That is wrong.
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#23
1 hr ago BoB wrote:
I was at a meeting last night and it was pointed out that the Osprey Cove community was not open to any one campagining unless they lived in that community. That is some thing that has to be also looked into. It was pointed out they can go into any neighborhood in the city and ask for votes. That is wrong.
The legality of that is being looked into. As Bob the Builder said, it was a "stacked-deck" scenario.
Note: "Bob" and "Leonard"are both alter-egos of a certain Canadian Green eco-weenie.
That's an interesting question. I can see where it would drive our resident alien Marxist and her fellow travelers absolutely bonkers. My guess is that a court would rule that the gated communities do indeed have the right to deny entry to non- residents, period. Their status as qualified politcal candidates should have no effect on the matter. Said non-resident candidates can still campaign inside of the community via the mail, the telephone, the electronic media, and even a plane towing a banner. Conversely, insofar as qualified candidates who are residents of the gated community otherwise have a legal right to be inside of the gates, barring a covenant forbidding it, I see no reason why they should not be able to campaign door-to-door in the community. I see no reason why they should not also be able to use the comunity's facilities (i.e., golf club / country club, etc) for an exclusive political rally. Think of it this way: if a candidate knocks on my door in my un-gated community, I can make the individual decision to not answer the door on a "retail" level. The Osprey Cove folks have simply made that decision on the "wholesale" level.
Your thoughts?
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16 comments:
That assumes that the residents unanimously agreed to "bar the gate." In fact, there were residents within that gated community who wished to allow a candidate to come in and campaign. They were told in no uncertain terms that it would not be allowed. On the other hand, candidates who did not live in the community but did agree with the majority were welcomed. It got so bad that some individuals were threatened for having the "wrong" candidate's campaign sign in their yard. They were given 10 days to remove the sign. They complied since 10 days was up the day after the election. Whoops!!!
This argument leads us no place because the election is over and the results aren't going to change. Let's just move on and if we made mistakes, do it better next time.
Could you fill us in on the source of your information? Do you live in Osprey Cove. It is not a question of unanimous agreement. My fence cannot be over six feet high, must be of a certain design and mnaterials,a nd cannot come forward of the back edge of my house. That was not by unanimous agreement. That was by the developers recorded covenants and restrictions which I agreed to at closing, jsut as all Osprey Covers did. Whiel a resident could certainly invite a candidate to his home as his guest and probably host a party for said candidate, he could not authorize a non-reisdent candiodate to campaign door-to-door. I see nothing sinister or un-American about that.
As to candidates signs in their yards, who gave the "warnings." Isn't it more likely that the restrictions forbid ANY political yard signs and that all who had them were given ten-days to remove them?
Now, if one resident advised another that he had the "wrong" campaign sign, that does not constitute and official warning from they developer, and, while thuggish, is not illegal unless there was a threat of violence if it was not removed.
So far, I just don't see any wrongdoing here. I find a restriction against any lawn signs a bit much(I had four)but the ban on non-resident door-to-door campaigning seems okay to me.
For the record, Osprey Cove does not allow any campaign signs to be place anywhere in the community. If you can prove to me there were campaign signs in the community, I will retract that statement. But I don’t think you can. That is why, if you paid attention, there were many across St. Marys Rd, on the shoulder of the west bound lanes of St. Marys Rd so residents could see them as they exited the community. Yes, they do block all candidates from coming in and going door to door to solicit votes. I personally would agree with that, gated community or not. Some candidates held forums at personal homes where the homeowner could invite anyone they wanted. Again, nothing wrong with that. If those that lost the election, did not take the time or think to reach out to that part of the community, shame on them. I know for a fact Keith Post does not live in Osprey Cove, I don’t know about the others. So this whole Osprey Cove homeowners were the only ones elected is BUNK!!!
Anno #23
Are tax dollars spent for any kind of work within the gated community? If so, all citizens should have reasonable access. i have a friend who lives there and wanted to personally take a candidate around and was told no.
When I went to vote at the middle school I saw many cars with out of state tags and Osprey Cove little blue stickers coming and going. It made me think, if they don't have local tags we must not be getting ad valorem taxes from them.
Well, I'm guessing they have city water and sewer. So, in your opinion , does that mean any similarly serviced gated communities across the country are illegal?
What is the relevance of some not yet having transferred their vehicle registrations to the matter at hand?
By law there is a thirty day time period to transfer registration. Obviously they transferred license in order to vote
the point about maintenance Is regarding roads and other maintenance.
Let’s break this down. I live in a gated community, and it is not Osprey, nor in St Marys.
(You said)
Are tax dollars spent for any kind of work within the gated community? If so, all citizens should have reasonable access. i have a friend who lives there and wanted to personally take a candidate around and was told no.
(I say)
For roads, no tax dollars are spent. For infrastructure like water and sewer, yes, St. Marys is paid for that service, so they should maintain it. IF you have a friend who lives there, which at this point I doubt, why did he/she not have said candidate get in he/she’s car to get in the neighborhood and go from there?
(You said)
When I went to vote at the middle school I saw many cars with out of state tags and Osprey Cove little blue stickers coming and going. It made me think, if they don't have local tags we must not be getting ad valorem taxes from them.
(I say)
If they have out of state tags, as you suggest, they did not vote. In order to vote, they must claim residents in Camden County, and have Camden County Tags and pay ad valorem taxes.
So to me this is a total fabrication on your part. Your candidate lost, and did not go the distance so to speak to involve all St. Marys residence.
Anno #23
This TOPIX "Salamander" is, of course, a certain Canadian Marxist Green eco-weenie who is apparently running low on literary names and has switched to endangered species.
Salamander Reply »
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|#25
12 hrs ago I've been watching this whole election process unfold. As a resident of St. Marys, are my tax dollars not going to provide services for Osprey Cove? I believe so. Should candidates for my city's elected office not then have equal access during their campaigns so that the outcome of any election reflects the will of the majority of citizens?
As more and more of these "gated communities" spring up around our (sic) country we must prepare ourselves for government by, and for, the wealthy denizens of these isolated and privileged areas.
They are drawn to our small towns by the "quaint" beauty of them and yet stay behind the walls to pull the strings based upon the censored information available to them.
It begs the questions: are they so afraid of independent thought and the true democratic process that they are unwilling to listen to alternate views? Is the pristine state of a lawn or belief so important that they "gate" their minds as well as their communities? What is so frightening or disturbing to these people that they would not welcome inside-the-gate town hall forums or free speech?
Osprey Cove does not allow any signs in yards. If there were any political signs in any yard, that resident would be violating covenants. Soliciting is not allowed per covenants. My question for Osprey Cove is was Mr. DeLoughy in violation of covenants when he went door to door soliciting votes? If so, that needs to be addressed by the Homeowners' Assoc. If not, then any candidate who is invited and accompanied by a resident would be able to campaign door to door.
A. Do we know if Bill Deloughy campaigned door-to-door in Osprey Cove?
B. Do we know if they have a restriction?
C. If he did and they do, and you don't live there, what makes it any of your legitimate business?
Why comment???YOU WON'T PRINT IT IF IT RAISES QUESTIONS THAT THREATEN YOUR CREDIBILITY.
??. I've not not published any comment on this subject so far. Give it a shot. I would be interested to see how my "credibility" has been put on the line in this instance. I have no idea how the covennats and restrictions read at Osprey Cove - and don't care.
A.Yes, he did go door to door soliciting votes. B. Yes,there is no soliciting in Osprey Cove. C. Yes, I live in Osprey Cove. And I think you were rude in your reply.
Thank you for your concise, seriatim answers. Apparently, you have an exceptionally low thresold for "rudeness." That was not my intention. I hope you will concede that had you not ben a resident of Osprey Cove, it would indeed have been none of your business.
Now, as to soliciting: I'm sure that the restriction was aimed at door-to-door salesmen. While it is true that Deloughy was "soliciting" people's votes, he was not soliciting in the usual, commercial sense. Perhaps that provision needs some clarification. However, if the internal OC powers tat be deem that he was in violation, that is still no business of the non-OC general public. As a property owner, he certainly had an undeniable right to be inside the gate whereas other non-owner candidates did not.
I sent Bill Deloughy an e-mail this morning asking him if he did campaign door-to-door in Osprey Cove. Here is his response.
Jay,
I went door to door through out the city as well as Osprey Cove.
Thanks,
Bill
I don't know what Mr. Deloughy calls "door-to-door" , but he certainly did not come to mine. In fact, the only person that has made mention, to me, of him knocking on their door lives in Osprey Cove. That's not proof that he did not, just an observation.
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